Luzerne Co. Sheriff's office REFUSED my wifes permit application

[Pa. Patriot]

Wife went to Sheriff's office with completed LTCF application.

Clerk looks at it and opines that the two references signatures were NOT signed/signatures

The two references are women and their signatures are neat and legible, as from experience I've seen many womens are..

My wife tried to explain that that is indeed their signatures. Even suggesting he call them (their number is on the app) at which time clerk basically ignored her and continued on to the next applicant as if he had no concern of being wrong or facing any legal action.

I think he made a boo-boo. I'll post updates. Right now I'm too busy to research the best course of action but it bothers me they handled it in such an unprofessional manner. This is quite routine, unfortunately, in my experiences with this dept.

[Steve in PA]

Stankus and his deputies are a bunch of bafoons.

Gee, my signature looks more like printing than a signature.......does that mean I can't sign either???

A persons signature is there signature.

[bubba23]

Don't let some clerk push you/her around. Talk to the Sheriff directly before you waste money hiring a lawyer.

[Johannes_Paulsen]

This is outrageous. Agreed, take it up to the sheriff. Did she get the name of the clerk?

And don't forget to vote in November....

[Pa. Patriot]

Originally Posted by bubba23

Don't let some clerk push you/her around. Talk to the Sheriff directly before you waste money hiring a lawyer.

I need to look up the controlling code to see if this "signed" reference is even still required before I call Stankus.

Here is the app and instructions for Luzerne Co.

http://dsf.pacounties.org/luzerne/li...R_INTERNET.pdf

I notice that it is NOT the same as other counties I've looked at. So far THREE others.

Here is a link to the Delaware Co. app and instructions:
http://www.co.delaware.pa.us/sheriff/weapons.html

Nowhere does it specify signature for the references.

Me thinks Luzerne Co. is adding requirements not in the code.

[bubba23]

Originally Posted by Pa. Patriot

I need to look up the controlling code to see if this "signed" reference is even still required before I call Stankus.

I can tell you for a fact that in Lancaster Country, the references DO NOT need to sign anything.

[craigc]

Could the State AGs office straighten things out I thought everything was supposed to be uniform

[Pa. Patriot]

Seems pretty clear to me. Guess I need to get on the phone.

§6109. Licenses.

(a) Purpose of license -A license to carry a firearm shall be for the purpose of carrying a firearm concealed on or about one's person or in a vehicle throughout this Commonwealth.

(b) Place of application.-An individual who is 21 years of age or older may apply to a sheriff for a license to carry a firearm concealed on or about his person or in a vehicle within this Commonwealth. If the applicant is a resident of this Commonwealth, he shall make application with the sheriff of the county in which he resides or, if a resident of a city of the first class, with the chief of police of that city.

(c) Form of application and content.-The application for a license to carry a firearm shall be uniform throughout this Commonwealth and shall be on a form prescribed by the Pennsylvania State Police. The form may contain provisions, not exceeding one page, to assure compliance with this section. Issuing authorities shall use only the application form prescribed by the Pennsylvania State Police. One of the following reasons for obtaining a firearm license shall be set forth in the application: self-defense, employment, hunting and fishing, target shooting, gun collecting or another proper reason. The application form shall be dated and signed by the applicant and shall contain the following statement:

I have never been convicted of a crime of violence in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania or elsewhere. I am of sound mind and have never been committed to a mental institution. I hereby certify that the statements contained herein are true and correct to the best of my knowledge and belief. I understand that, if I knowingly make any false statements herein, I am subject to penalties prescribed by law. I authorize the sheriff, or his designee, or, in the case of first class cities, the chief or head of the police department, or his designee, to inspect only those records or documents relevant to information required for this application.

(d) Sheriff to conduct investigation.-The sheriff to whom the application is made shall investigate the applicant's record of criminal convictions, shall investigate whether or not the applicant is under indictment for or has ever been convicted of a crime punishable by imprisonment exceeding one year, shall investigate whether the applicant's character and reputation are such that the applicant will not be likely to act in a manner dangerous to public safety and shall investigate whether the applicant would be precluded from receiving a license under subsection (e)(1) or section 6105(h) (relating to persons not to possess, use, manufacture, control, sell or transfer firearms) and shall conduct a criminal background, juvenile delinquency or mental health check following the procedures set forth in section 6111 (relating to firearm ownership).

(e) Issuance of license.
(1) A license to carry a firearm shall be for the purpose of carrying a firearm concealed on or about one's person or in a vehicle and shall be issued if, after an investigation not to exceed 45 days, it appears that the applicant is an individual concerning whom no good cause exists to deny the license. A license shall not be issued to any of the following:
(i) An individual whose character and reputation is such that the individual would be likely to act in a manner dangerous to public safety.
(ii) An individual who has been convicted of an offense under the act of April 14, 1972 (P.L. 233, No. 64), known as The Controlled Substance, Drug, Device and Cosmetic Act.
(iii) An individual convicted of a crime enumerated in section 6105.
(iv) An individual who, within the past ten years, has been adjudicated delinquent for a crime enumerated in section 6105 or for an offense under The Controlled Substance, Drug, Device and Cosmetic Act.
(v) An individual who is not of sound mind or who has ever been committed to a mental institution.
(vi) An individual who is addicted to or is an unlawful user of marijuana or a stimulant, depressant or narcotic drug.
(vii) An individual who is a habitual drunkard.
(viii) An individual who is charged with or has been convicted of a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year except as provided for in section 6123 (relating to waiver of disability or pardons).
(ix) A resident of another state who does not possess a current license or permit or similar document to carry a firearm issued by that state if a license is provided for by the laws of that state, as published annually in the Federal Register by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms of the Department of the Treasury under 18 U.S.C. §921(a)(19) (relating to definitions).
(x) An alien who is illegally in the United States.
(xi) An individual who has been discharged from the armed forces of the United States under dishonorable conditions.
(xii) An individual who is a fugitive from justice. This subparagraph does not apply to an individual whose fugitive status is based upon* nonmoving or moving summary offense under Title 75 (relating to vehicles).
*So in original. Probably "a" should be inserted.
(xiii) An individual who is otherwise prohibited from possessing, using, manufacturing, controlling, purchasing, selling or transferring a firearm as provided by section 6105.
(2) (Deleted)
(3) The license shall bear the name, address, date of birth, race, sex, citizenship, Social Security number, height, weight, color of hair, color of eyes and signature of the licensee; the signature of the sheriff issuing the license; the reason for issuance; and the period of validation. The sheriff may also require a photograph of the licensee on the license. The original license shall be issued to the applicant. The first copy of the license shall be forwarded to the commissioner within seven days of the date of issue, and a second copy shall be retained by the issuing authority for a period of six years.

(f) Term of license.
(1) A license to carry a firearm issued under subsection (e) shall be valid throughout this Commonwealth for a period of five years unless sooner revoked.
(2) At least 60 days prior to the expiration of each license, the issuing sheriff shall send to the licensee an application for renewal of license. Failure to receive a renewal application shall not relieve a licensee from the responsibility to renew the license.

(g) Grant or denial of license.-Upon the receipt of an application for a license to carry a firearm, the sheriff shall, within 45 days, issue or refuse to issue a license on the basis of the investigation under subsection (d) and the accuracy of the information contained in the application. If the sheriff refuses to issue a license, the sheriff shall notify the applicant in writing of the refusal and the specific reasons. The notice shall be sent by certified mail to the applicant at the address set forth in the application.

(h) Fee.-The fee for a license to carry a firearm is $19. This includes a renewal notice processing fee of $1.50. This includes an administrative fee of $5 under section 14(2) of the act of July 6, 1984 (P.L. 614, No. 127), known as the Sheriff Fee Act. No fee other than that provided by this paragraph or the Sheriff Fee Act may be assessed by the sheriff for the performance of any background check made pursuant to this act. The fee is payable to the sheriff to whom the application is submitted and is payable at the time of application for the license. Except for the administrative fee of $5 under section 14(2) of the Sheriff Fee Act, all other fees shall be refunded if the application is denied but shall not be refunded if a license is issued and subsequently revoked. A person who sells or attempts to sell a license to carry a firearm for a fee in excess of the amounts fixed under this subsection commits a summary offense.

(i) Revocation.-A license to carry firearms may be revoked by the issuing authority for good cause. A license to carry firearms shall be revoked by the issuing authority for any reason
stated in subsection (e)(1) which occurs during the term of the permit. Notice of revocation shall be in writing and shall state the specific reason for revocation. Notice shall be sent by certified mail, and, at that time, a copy shall be forwarded to the commissioner. An individual whose license is revoked shall surrender the license to the issuing authority within five days of receipt of the notice. An individual whose license is revoked may appeal to the court of common pleas for the judicial district in which the individual resides. An individual who violates this section commits a summary offense.

(j) Immunity.-A sheriff who complies in good faith with this section shall be immune from liability resulting or arising from the action or misconduct with a firearm committed by any individual to whom a license to carry a firearm has been issued.

(k) Reciprocity.-The attorney general may enter into reciprocity agreements with other states providing for the mutual recognition of each state's license to carry a firearm.

(Chgd. by L.1998, Act 70(3), eff. 6/18/98.)

[ChamberedRound]

What a bunch of crap that is. Stinks of someone looking for an excuse to deny as many applications as they can.

One question for everyone here: does a denied LTC application go on record? In other words, can being denied for an LTC, especially for something stupid like this, make it difficult (or impossible) to get an LTC in the future?

Thx!

[bubba23]

FWIW, here is a link to the Lancaster County PDF form SP 4-127 (5-2006).

http://www.co.lancaster.pa.us/sherif...PPLICATION.pdf