Fined at a public range today

[MikeyMac]

I brought my nephew and his friend, both 21 years old, to an outdoor public range for thier first time shooting in Fogelsville, PA. We first started firing my .22 Ruger semi rifle but it kept jamming after two to three rounds at most. During this time, a range officer was watching us. Since my ruger kept jamming, we change to my Mini-14 with a five shot clip. (Range rules indicate three rounds max!)

The "Range Officer" stood-by and waited until all three of us fired-off five shots at a time. He did nothing after I made my first five shots. He did nothing after my nephew fired his five shots. He waited until all of us fired five shots and approached us and gave us the "third" degree for the three of us. He asked for our dirvers licenses, social security numbers, place of employment and inspected my nephew's car. He gave us all violations for firing over three rounds. My main question is: after this "range officer" notices a violation in the first place, should he have NOT waited until I started firing the FIRST five shots?? This never happened to me before and I need to know the truth regarding this. Thank you.

-MikeyMac

[TrybalRage]

Eww. 3 rounds max? What the hell is that?

I've never shot at a public range, so I don't know what kind of power the 'range officer' has, but I think there might have been a problem with searching anything or getting any SS numbers.

[ithinkimamedic]

That's intresting. The range I frequent is a SGL's range and they have the same rule but they always come and remind you, there have NEVER been that dick to me. I wish you luck.

[Chevmeister]

first never give a ss# second he has no right to inspect your car. unless he has a warant. seems like way to much info to be asking for. is this guy a cop? is he park police? park ranger? who do you pay the fine to? Where was the range?
If i was approached like that i would unload my weapon put it away and leave. They cant do anything unless they are a leo of some sort. Were you shooting rapid, was it unsafe?

Final question is if there was a RO there and it said 3 shot max, why did you load 5.

[1927A1]

At the Pine Creek state range the park ranger will not allow the use of non-hunting guns. So with that light, Mini 14's would be banned.

[JustinM]

Rules are rules.

A range officer, is just that. (Don't know about the car thing)

You knew the rules, and you chose to break them. What did you expect?

[Steve in PA]

By "range officer" do you mean a PGC WCO or something else?

If you knew about the 3-round limitation, and you well should have, you really have no one to blame but yourself.

That said, the correct thing (in my mind) would have been for this range officer to come over to you as soon as he saw you pick up the rifle and mention/go over the range rules.

[Justin]

as far as i know, there are no official "range officers" at sgl, I assume you mean a WCO who was at the range.

sgl has a regulation that when more than 1 person is using the range a "range officer" shall be designated. that is pretty loosely interpreted, and a wco may have been acting as the range officer. a cvilian/ non leo/wco could be a range officer, but cant fine you.

just being at the range constitutes acceptance of the rules and regulations, and it is your responsibility to know them.

that being said, i would doubt that it is required that they confront you and issue a fine as soon as they witness a violation of the regulations. it would have been a little more professional, and the right thing to do to come over and inform you of the rules and warn or fine you as soon as the violation occured.

I would not have given out an ssn without first asking if i was required to do so, and then asking the officer to cite the law or regulation requiring this.

as far as inspection of the vehicle, was consent given? i dont know the law on this, but there are some goofy laws on sgl property, and he very well may be allowed to inspect your vehicle without your consent whether or not a violation has occured.

i would file a report with his office and superior officers regarding your experience if you feel his actions were out of line when inspecting your vehicle and requesting your ssn.

[soberbyker]

I was at a SGL range in Tafton, Pike County on Easter morning, two guys shooting rifles and one shooting a handgun. My fiancé's father was shooting a rifle and I was shooting my Kahr and a 22lr handgun with her son. We didn't notice the rules at first, I was shooting 7 round clips and I know the 22 had a lot more than that. No "officers" of any kind there, but that may have been due to it being Easter. On the way out I did see the rule board, it was kind of worn and small print, I didn't have my reading glasses, but I did see the three shot clip limit, for rifles. The following was taken from the State Game Land web site @

http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/v...a=480&q=161297

Users should also practice good shooting etiquette. The regulation, for example, that limits a shooter to having no more than three rounds in a rifle (six in a handgun) may not seem to make much sense.

What it does, though, is give shooters a chance to check their targets without having to wait for those who may want to shoot long strings. This same regulation prohibits people using firearms with large capacity magazines from monopolizing time on the range, and also causing inordinate damage, particularly to backstops

I will surely remember that next time. I try to follow the rules, whether I agree with them or not, I don't want some pencil pusher using my violation in a pile of stats to prove why us gun owners need to have more regulations thrown at us.

[Statkowski]

From the Pennsylvania Game Commission website:

Prohibited Acts: At rifle and handgun ranges located on land under Game Commission ownership, except when authorized:
1) Possess a loaded firearm , except at an established shooting station on the firing line.
2) Discharge a firearm, except from an established shooting station on the firing line at a paper target placed on a permanent backboard.
3) Discharge armor-piercing, incendiary, explosive, tracer or multiple-projectile ammunition.
4) Be intoxicated, use or possess alcohol or a controlled substance.
5) Possess an automatic firearm.
6) Possess, load or discharge a firearm that contains more than three rounds of single projectile ammunition, except at a PGC facility specifically designated as a handgun range an individual is permitted to load and discharge a handgun containing a maximum of six rounds of single projectile ammunition at any one time.

I'll have to pass on that info to my son, especially Item 3 and Item 6. My son's shotgun has a ten-round magazine. Slugs appear okay, but not shotshells.