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Old December 6th, 2008, 02:55 AM
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Default DPMS - Common Problems?

I was just reading through this thread here;

http://forum.pafoa.org/rifles-42/407...refer-why.html

The concern has been raised to a number of issues concerning these rifles, and others like it that are not "top tier" as far as some people would consider in AR rifles.

I'm already in the process of upgrading some of the fit and finish of this rifle. (Stock, rail system, break, grip, etc) But if there are things that would increase the reliability of the weapon I would like to stop where I am and factor those things in to the global monetary cost of things planned.

I would like a well rounded performer I can depend on. The downside is, its bought and paid for - so "leave it alone and go buy a colt" doesn't do me much good. I paid $600 for this rifle, (bought ON electon day!) and I'm sure I will exceed that and then some by the time it is where I want it.

Now, lets focus on some of the prime issues that are show stoppers that I CAN fix. Their causes, and how to spot them. I am trying to gain some ground here, as many of you are advanced well beyond where I am with these rifles. I'm asking for a bit of a ketchup. Before any of these things fall into the 'too late' category.

There is maybe 300 rounds through the rifle. So its possibly still in the time frame where things can be fixed before they cause damage to other components, or the receivers, chamber etc.

Many of you are adamant about certain aspects of these lower tier rifles being piss poor, or unreliable. I'm asking for your worst, but also a little direction in how to spot if they are an issue in my rifle. This may be even more relevant to me because I have the red headed step child of AR15's. Entry level DPMS - Sportical.

My rifle;
DPMS Sportical
A2 flash hider - (Primary Weapons FSC556 on the way)
16" Lite-barrel 1x9 twist no chrome
Site rail gas block (loose as a goose - tightened)
AP4 hand guards (being replaced with yhm/larue/omega?)
Flat top - M4 ramps No forward assist, no dust cover (replace for d/c?)
Park bolt carrier group - M16 profile, but half taken down at rear section.
(More than SP1, less than M16, no cutaway for hammer catch)
Standard charging handle. (Appears to wear crazy fast on left side. Finish is just coming off like hell.) Add tactical latch?
Standard trigger (DPMS receiver rug - stock trigger is fine to me)
Standard grip (MIAD? Tango down?)
Folding BUIS - Now I paid $69 ea. But they look JUST like GG&G front gas block one. And the rear is push button take down / multi-aperture as well.
Pardus stock 6 pos (Magpul CTR coming)
Here are some pics for proper identification. When I bought them (BUIS) they were in baggies. Not that this is even a big deal, they seem to work perfect. Front post is painted white because I can't friggin see it in any low light conditions. (trijicon tritium fr/rr drop in replacements highly considered)












Problems encountered thus far:
Stripping the next round. It would eject, but not strip the next round.
-Solution:
Tighten front gas block so gas stays in the gun. Imagine that.

That's about it.

Shoots more accurately than I can at this point. I need more seat time with aperture sights. Coming from an AK I pretty much hate them. I'm used to a mid ship / muzzle end sight configuration and can't seem to get the mid / mid sight platform of the AR. From a rest I can pick the center out of targets @ 50yds like it was my job. (no feat I know) Standing forget it. They spread to 4" or worse. And with the AK I can do that moving rapid fire at the same distance.

Its comfort level at this point. I'll get my butt out there and get better.


Its obviously not a combat weapon. But if I'm going to spend money on it. Then it might as well improve in area's of reliability as much as it does anywhere else. I'm sure there are things I am completely oblivious to that could be potential problems down the road. So if you wanted a prime opportunity to throw some garbage at the lower tier AR15's. I'm asking for it.

Really. But if you are going to list concerns, try to give me the warning signs if there are any as well. I'm trying to learn as much as I can here.

Thank you guys as always.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 03:11 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

I think you are making more out of this than there is. Some people just like their "brand" better.

I have no personal experience with DPMS so i can't say anything "failed" on one. I would be willing to bet that the average Joe shooter will not experience any "real" problems with one. It isn't like the average shooter is putting thousands of rounds down range on full auto every day. Most shooters are lucky to put 1k down range a year.

The things i see as important
Keep it clean and lubed
keep an eye on the extractor and spring
keep an eye on the gas rings on the bolt
keep it clean and lubed
keep it clean and lubed
oh, and keep it clean and lubed

OOPS forgot to add also make sure the bolt carrier is properly staked so the bolts don't come loose.

As for signs look to make sure there is no wear on the extractor and replace the spring / oring when you have problems. It doesn't hurt to have a few spares around. As for the bolt gas rings, look for carbon build up and make sure the "gaps" are staggered and not in line.

Last edited by Guns4Fun; December 6th, 2008 at 03:20 AM.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 04:22 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

I probably will put more than 1k rounds downrange in 6 months. Per gun. Maybe not so much in the winter but I like to go out and shoot. This usually equates to some target shooting, followed by moving and shooting, followed by moving as a group and shooting. And to finish off the day a mag dump or two. In the cold, its maybe reduced to 60-100 rounds and mostly target shooting. In the warm, 250-300 rounds a session is not uncommon.

Needless to say - you won't find me at a range. I have private property to shoot on - and I make good use of it whenever time allows.

I learned to keep it wet for storage, and keep oil bottle in my pocket so before I roll up to the line. I add a couple drops to the BCG, and receiver surfaces. Cycle the charging handle to disperse, fresh mag. Good to go.

I know a good bit of what I saw could very well be exaggerated, opinionated justifications for people spending 3x what I did. However... there is always truth to the $ = quality game. So if it gives me information to wade through, and I actually catch something before I have a problem. Its worth being knee deep in it. How do you make sure the gas key is properly staked? Check for rotation against the tamp marks? Or is there any other kind of orientation of the gas key that can be out of spec? Such as (does it center itself perfectly with the screws?) out of center installation making it ride harder on one side. Etc.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 06:51 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

Where is the wear on the CH? You said left side but is it on the inner surface, the outer left side, any on tip? The gas key should be staked so that the displaced metal is touching the bolt. However it is possible that the bolt may not have been tightened properly possibly causing the key to rotate or flex slightly on the carrier. Does the bolt hold open on the last shot? If not it could be possible that gas is leaking from the key and short stroking. It could also be weak magazine springs or a sticky follower, what kind are you using and what follower is in them? As far as the gas rings go, as long as they hold the bolt in the carrier I wouldnt worry about them, just put a drop or two of oil on them upon reassembly. They will work fine with all the gas ring gaps lined up or even with only one ring in a properly functioning rifle. Beyond that most will be up to personal preference. Check which version of the CTR you ordered as the reciever extension DPMS uses with the Pardus stock in not a milspec tube.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 09:22 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Legion_Prime View Post
Where is the wear on the CH? You said left side but is it on the inner surface, the outer left side, any on tip? The gas key should be staked so that the displaced metal is touching the bolt. However it is possible that the bolt may not have been tightened properly possibly causing the key to rotate or flex slightly on the carrier. Does the bolt hold open on the last shot? If not it could be possible that gas is leaking from the key and short stroking. It could also be weak magazine springs or a sticky follower, what kind are you using and what follower is in them? As far as the gas rings go, as long as they hold the bolt in the carrier I wouldnt worry about them, just put a drop or two of oil on them upon reassembly. They will work fine with all the gas ring gaps lined up or even with only one ring in a properly functioning rifle. Beyond that most will be up to personal preference. Check which version of the CTR you ordered as the reciever extension DPMS uses with the Pardus stock in not a milspec tube.
You'll have to excuse me. I suffer from douche-lexia. Its when you say left, but mean right. It had slight wear on the left outside edge on the charging handle, but its even worse on the right. There is some on the bottom too.

There is also a shiny path in the receiver on the right side too where it has taken the anodizing off the inside of the receiver. (In the charging handle groove. Could this be simply from me pulling it not 100% straight back and it riding harder on the right since I'm tugging slightly left. Like / <---








I always blame user error first. Components second.

Bolt always holds open. Mags are DPMS black mags with green follower.

Bolt is snug in the carrier. It pulls out with slight resistance. When you break it down for cleaning.

The key screws are staked. The key is not?















Bought CTR commercial. It is definitely a commercial tube.
The most wear on the rifle appears to be the cam pin. It looked like it caught an asswhoopin' from the first time out shooting it. I know it pivots metal on metal. But everything else looks like its shot 300 rounds. It looks like its seen 3000. Typical?

Last edited by Asmodeus6; December 6th, 2008 at 09:27 AM.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 09:48 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

The bolt carrier looks properly staked to me.

I get a little wear on my charging handle on my colt too. It isn't as bad as yours and i've got a couple thousand rounds through mine. I don't know that i'd be worried too much since the charging handle doesn't move durring operation and the wear is on the outside. Although, it does look like you might have some wear on the inside toward the back in that one pic. I can't tell for sure because my monitor sucks and all pics look like crap on my monitor (it is my monitor not your pics). I'm no expert so maybe someone else that has more knowledge can explain why you are getting the drag on the charging handle that you are.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 10:04 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guns4Fun View Post
The bolt carrier looks properly staked to me.

I get a little wear on my charging handle on my colt too. It isn't as bad as yours and i've got a couple thousand rounds through mine. I don't know that i'd be worried too much since the charging handle doesn't move durring operation and the wear is on the outside. Although, it does look like you might have some wear on the inside toward the back in that one pic. I can't tell for sure because my monitor sucks and all pics look like crap on my monitor (it is my monitor not your pics). I'm no expert so maybe someone else that has more knowledge can explain why you are getting the drag on the charging handle that you are.
I think its the way I yank it. Its actually quite serious to pull that thing. Even dripping wet with lube, (mine) compared to my buddies (20" HBAR A2 Bushmaster) who... practically NEVER cleans or lubes the damn thing... his pulls like nothing. I broke his gun down 3 days ago, and its caked! And it still out shoots, and operates mine. Its like an atomic clock! You'd swear it was an AK. Runs like an absolute champ and 95% of its diet is Wolf!

Its not even tight in the groove. In fact it may be too loose that it will actually let me pull at an angle too much. Again, maybe its just me. I don't ride the handle back either.

It may be your monitor, but its also kind of hard to take pics of really shiny oiled up parts. There IS a wear mark in the charging handle groove IN the receiver. Its a 10MP Samsung digi. Thing takes amazing pictures. But has trouble focusing sometimes in my cave lit house. Shiny parts + flash = trouble when your trying to show shiny wear marks.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 10:34 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

I'd say everything looks normal, you don't happen to be ambidextrous do you? I only ask because my aunt is and you do not ever allow her to give directions unless she is there to point as she truely does not know her left from right. the wear on your CH really wouldn't concern me. Your gas key bolts are properly staked as was mentioned before. You can see the witness marks on the bearing surfaces running the length of the bolt carrier, in time the finish will wear completely off them and their corresponding surfaces inside the upper and that will smooth out the action. Since you have a 16" and a carbine gas system I would check your extractor and make sure it has the correct black carbine insert and replace it if it has the blue rifle insert, they can be had for about $5 from Bravo Co and others I'm sure. Since you are getting a commercial stock for a commercial diameter tube you should be GTG there. The pivot pin appearing to wear faster is perfectly normal as it takes a great deal of lateral force in both directions. It looks like as long as that gas block stays secure putting more lead downrange is my recommended course of action. I personally would want a bare minimum of an ejection port cover on any AR I owned but that is personal preference which to the best of my knowledge would be the only thing affecting any further purchases at this point.
As for oiling at the range a drop each in the two holes in the bolt carrier ought to be sufficient for the couple hundred rounds you shoot in a session. is that a single point sling? the only recommendation there is to put in a SRB to be able to quickly disconnect from the rifle and then you can also swap it between rifles easier. AS far as rails go read up. LaRue would be what I'd go with, YHM are known for being larger and sharp as shit IIRC. I always recommend getting hands on a couple different ones and seeing which you like before buying, same with grips. The MIAD does have interchangable front and backstraps so you can fit it to your hand which gets a big thumbs up from me. The FSC556 has recieved nothing but positive reviews anywhere I've heard it mentioned so it sounds like you're headed the right direction and have a fine rifle. XS Sight Systems Makes a variety of front tritium and white stripe and rear sights for the AR which are worth checking out as well.
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Old December 6th, 2008, 11:50 AM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

No I'm not ambicockstrous. My woman isn't either. But cannot get left and right to save her life. I think that was just because its the side of the rifle I see when I'm holding it. Or some other retardo related slip.

The ejection port cover is on my list of things I want. One march off through the woods with it and I had a small collection of whatzitfuck sticking to the bolt. Not OK.

The plan here is to pick the forearm I want. And then since I would already be pulling the barrel. Replace the upper. All in one shot to avoid doing things multiple times. Trying to get my hands on a DPMS flat top at a reasonable price. That way it all matches. Not to be a queen, but the DPMS finish seems darker than some of the others. Its a DPMS gun, I can stomach the matching upper. Besides, if I get one that will take a dust cover then I can get this.


It IS a single point sling. Need clarification on "SRB". I got it when I got the rifle because it had no real provision for a 2 or 3 point. So I figured I'd just get "A" sling and a end plate with a loop. Well, that plate sucked, because it was for a standard sling, and basically cut your fingers off when you pulled the charging handle. So I replaced THAT one with a small lower clip on style hole from DPMS. For what its worth, the single point is useful for not setting your rifle down on the table if you don't want to while you are standing there. That's about it. This sling comes off in about 2 seconds. You squeeze the clothed nose and the "ring" splits apart becoming two 3/4 rings and you can take it right off. The sling has a break away buckle incorporated into it.

When I get a front rail system, I want to go to something more useful that actually holds the rifle so I don't have to.

The MIAD might be a necessity as my woman also shoot the rifle. she has small hands so I have to watch throwing on something too big. It gives options.

The FSC556 / well, I have a similar product on the AK. Its so good I said I'd buy it again in a heart beat. So I did.

I have a $112 credit with Optics Planet. I bought an NCStar 1.25-4x scope as an attempt to give the AR some reaching out ability while still being OK for closer stuff. It didn't work. Literally... crank the elevation knob and it did nada. It goes back. They have trijicon goodies there and ameriglo. They do the same thing but the triji's are $75 opposed to $150. They appear identical.

However... looking at that drop in from XS makes me hope that goes back on my card. That, is right up my alley. I was looking at the A.R.M.S. rear site as a replacement to get the notch back. Looks like I don't have to! Thanks man! Seriously!
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Old December 6th, 2008, 12:00 PM
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Default Re: DPMS - Common Problems?

I have had DPMS for a little over a year and can say I have had no problems at all. I did have one plastic snap cap that would get stuck in the barrel. It came 2 in pack 1 works fine, one always get stuck so I don't use the bad one. I have tried different brands of ammo and all fed with out a problem.
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