Use of Deadly Force

[pghjim]

I am looking for the sections of Title 18 and any other title that would pertain to the use of deadly force in your defense or the defense of others. Would also be interested in how this has been interpreted by the courts. A good summary and interpretation would be the best.

I have searched the forum and after reading through about 20 threads, I only have bits and pieces.

[JustinM]

Shoot them until they stop doing what caused you to shoot them. If that results in them dying, so be it. If someone's trying to kill you, you try to kill them. You can'e be engaged in a fight with someone and worrying about the law at the same time. that's a good way to lose.

[MarcS]

http://members.aol.com/StatutesP8/18PA505.html

Case law would take too much time to go over. If you look in an annotated text of PA title 18, the annotations under Homicide are half the book.

To sum it up, if you blast someone you're going to need to articulate Ability, Opportunity and Intent. That's the Ability of the guy you blasted to cause you great bodily harm/death (he had a gun, he had a knife, he had a club, he was frickin' huge). The Opportunity of the guy you blasted to do you harm (standing 100 yards away with a knife presents no opportunity to use it. the threat must be imminent). The Intent of the guy you blasted to do you said harm (what he said or did that put you in imminent fear of your life.)

[wewo]

Originally Posted by MarcS

http://members.aol.com/StatutesP8/18PA505.html

Case law would take too much time to go over. If you look in an annotated text of PA title 18, the annotations under Homicide are half the book.

To sum it up, if you blast someone you're going to need to articulate Ability, Opportunity and Intent. That's the Ability of the guy you blasted to cause you great bodily harm/death (he had a gun, he had a knife, he had a club, he was frickin' huge). The Opportunity of the guy you blasted to do you harm (standing 100 yards away with a knife presents no opportunity to use it. the threat must be imminent). The Intent of the guy you blasted to do you said harm (what he said or did that put you in imminent fear of your life.)

Well put, but dont forget the duty to retreat (be able to show that you could not safely retreat unless you were in your home where not necessary) and that you did not instigate the attack.

[pghjim]

A question about giving up your possessions if asked for. Does that mean if you are robbed at gun point you have to give up your wallet before you make the determination that he intends you harm?

[turkbender]

Chapter 18 sections 505- Use of force to protect your self
Link- http://members.aol.com/StatutesP8/18PA505.html

506- Use of force to protect someone else
Link- http://members.aol.com/StatutesP8/18PA506.html

507- Use of force to protect property
Link- http://members.aol.com/StatutesP8/18PA507.html

In PA we are permited to use deadly force when we are in danger of death or seriouse bodily injury. seriouse bodily injury meaning close to death, loss of limbs, comma, extended hosspital stay type things that are far beyond a broken finger and what not. If such a thing happens in public u must attept to flee before using deadly force if possible, But if it would happen in your home or if you own a buisness and it would happen there you do not have to flee. we are also afforded the right to use deadly force in the act of fighting off a forcable sex crime or kidnaping.

[pghjim]

Yes, I read them. I am just not sure under 505 (b) 2 ii, that I must surrender my possession if the person believe he has a right to it.

[turkbender]

Title 18- chapter-5 section- 505- 2ii
the actor knows that he can avoid the necessity of using such force with complete safety by retreating( all this means is you must flee if it is safe and reasonable to do so) or by surrendering possession of a thing to a person asserting a claim of right thereto( I believe this means if someone is saying something is thiers you must surrender it in an attempt to dissolve the problem before resorting to deadly force) or by complying with a demand that he abstain from any action which he has no duty to take( I believe this just means if you were the one in the wrong you can not use deadly force.meaning you can not instigate/ initiate the problem)

[turkbender]

I am not a lawyer or anything close. I am just studying to take the Act 235 Certi. so if any of you lawyers know My interpritation is wrong please let me know.

[pghjim]

My part of this issue is surrendering possession at the point of a gun. If he believes my wallet is his because of the socialist society we are creating and has that gun pointed at me, can I use deadly force? Or, must I surrender the wallet then determine if he still intends to shoot me.