Are contrary views of Open Carry Verbooten on PAFOA

[CZ40P]

Quite frankly gentlemen, I am shocked! I read with great interest a thread started in the Concealed/Open Carry forum were a new member stated what I thought was a valid concern about open carry run-ins causing a backlash effect with the State Legislature.

Let me say I have supported the efforts of those who open carry in the past. I was present at the DC council meeting on May 13. I have openly carried in the past, I will openly carry in the future. Lately I to have started to wonder out loud if this will cause some kind of legislative backlash.

I was reading the thread started by Robert Kayland. I thought he made a few good points. Then he got tag teamed and the thread was closed because we can't discuss "Why OC". Everytime someone makes an argument that OC might be causing more harm than good the poster gets slammed. Why? You guys don't want to hear other opinions? Is it against forum rules to even suggest that open carry might be counter productive? Thats the way it seems to me. Mr Kayland made a few good points before you guys stuck your fingers in your ears and yelled , " La,La,LA,LA,LA,LA,LA,LA,LA"

Everybody says "It can't happen" They'd have to change the state constitution. Really..............How about they just change the trespassing statutes to make the signs carry the weight of law.........How about if they give local municipalities the option to ban open carry in congested areas. There are many ways to achieve any result.
Could it happen? Not Likely right now.........but what about in a few years when the face of the State Legislature changes yet again? After years of negative press over open carry, opinions may change.

Look I am not looking to get into a point/ counterpoint debate with the Open Carry Rangers. I am just saying you fellas are in the minority. You don't speak for me, you don't speak for a lot of folks on this forum. You don't speak for MOST of Pennsylvania! I am ashamed at the way Mr Kayland was bullied and shutdown.

If frank and open discussions are not allowed. If desenting opinions are stifled to create the illusion of solidarity ,then this forum is a sham and a PR tool for open carry zealots, If a handfull try and herd the discussion to fit their views, then this forum is doomed to the same fate as Packing.Org

[gnbrotz]

We can discuss "Why OC" as long as it is done civilly. As noted in the final post of the recently closed thread, there are MANY such discussions worthy of review by a newcomer, and available for ongoing discussion to continue. What we do not need, is ANOTHER such thread.

[ar15jules]

I think the forum has morphed into an OC activism forum. Forums do change with the wide variety of opinions of the various users. When it got to be too much so in the past, I took a month or two off. The best advice I can give to anyone is that if you are not interested in OC activism, simply stay away from the OC section of the forum. I know it has been suggested in the past to make a seperate section for CC issues. I would welcome that as well.
Jules

[PisnNapalm]

How many OC vs. CC threads does it take to kill a horse?

The way I see it is pretty much everything about OC/CC has been discussed. It's like reading reruns of old threads.

[rallen]

PisnNapalm, agreed.

Debate is welcome, but I do not believe that anyone on here even attempts to speak for the entirety of PA, let alone this board. Each of us OC/CC/or some other means of carry for our own reasons. That stands on its own without the arguing.

[CZ40P]

The aforementioned thread was NOT about OC vs CC, it asked the question " Will open carry lead to more negative gun laws? Will it cause a backlash ?

I guess we can't contemplate or discuss that.

[PisnNapalm]

Originally Posted by CZ40P

The aforementioned thread was NOT about OC vs CC, it asked the question " Will open carry lead to more negative gun laws? Will it cause a backlash ?

I guess we can't contemplate or discuss that.

That's not a new question in the OC vs CC debate.

It's been proposed by CC advocates that if too many people OC too often then the sheeple will complain to their masters and work to have OC prohibited.

OC advocates say that a right that unexercised is a right lost. And so it goes back and forth, back and forth.

What am I missing here? This has been discussed ad nauseum.

[gnbrotz]

Originally Posted by CZ40P

The aforementioned thread was NOT about OC vs CC, it asked the question " Will open carry lead to more negative gun laws? Will it cause a backlash ?

I guess we can't contemplate or discuss that.

From the long list of links posted in the now-closed thread, here are two that specifically apply to the backlash/new legislation angle. Both remain open and awaiting a civil discussion.

http://www.pafoa.org/forum/concealed...conundrum.html
http://www.pafoa.org/forum/concealed...ur-rights.html

[Kramer]

CZ40P you hit the nail on the head with your post and unfortunately it has caused this board to go down hill. Most of the people that push the OC issue are like little children on a playground that have to have it their way or they will go on screaming and crying until they get their way. There are way too many immature people on this board, it reminds me of AR15.com.

I even discussed this issue with other members and most of the "chest thumping", "fingers in your ears and yelled , " La,La,LA,LA,LA,LA,LA,LA,LA", "whinny crybabies" is from the younger crowd that still have not learned to play nice with others and be respectful of others opinions. Hopefully they will grow up before it's too late.

I also thought that it was a valid concern about open carry run-ins causing a backlash effect with the State Legislature, I hope that it nevers happens but if it does you will never hear the end if it from me and many others on this board.

[gnbrotz]

New legislation requested by County Commissioners and President County Judge because of open carry at a polling place:
http://www.pafoa.org/forum/pennsylva...ation-act.html

Result:
Epic FAIL

Dear Greg,

Thanks for your e-mail. As a follow-up to our telephone conversation a couple of weeks ago, Reps. Keller, Moul, Rock and I are sending a letter to the Franklin County Commissioners. The letter outlines the current PA statutes that could be used to prosecute coercive or inappropriate behavior at polling places. We also note that their letter stems from one particular incident in Franklin County at a recent election, in which their were no arrests for any offense under either the Crimes Code or Election Code.

Finally, and most importantly, we state that "We have concerns about limiting the exercise of one important constitutional right during the exercise of another. Given the extensive nature of current Commonwealth law regarding inappropriate behavior in any location, as well as additional laws which apply specifically to coercive activity at polling places, we believe the legislature has provided significant resources to address any concerns about intimidation at the polls."

Thanks for your continued advocacy on this issue.

Best regards,

Rob Kauffman
State Representative
89th Legislative District