Information sheet for LEO

[exceltoexcel]

I created a document to keep on me in-case I encounter an uninformed LEO or sheeple, I thought I'd share it with you.

Open Carry Legal in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania
Commonwealth v. Hawkins
In all parts of Pennsylvania, persons who are licensed may carry concealed firearms. 18 Pa.C.S. § 6108. *Except in Philadelphia, firearms may be carried openly without a license*. See Ortiz v. Commonwealth, ___ Pa. ___, ___, 681 A.2d 152, 155 (1996) (*only in Philadelphia must a person obtain a license for carrying a firearm whether it is unconcealed or concealed; in other parts of the Commonwealth, unconcealed firearms do not require a license*). The Commonwealth takes the radical position that police have a duty to stop and frisk when they receive information from any source that a suspect has a gun. Since it is not illegal to carry a licensed gun in Pennsylvania,4 it is difficult to see where this shocking idea originates, notwithstanding the Commonwealth's fanciful and histrionic references to maniacs who may spray schoolyards with gunfire and assassins of public figures who may otherwise go undetected. Even if the Constitution of Pennsylvania would permit such invasive police activity as the Commonwealth proposes -- which it does not -- such activity seems more likely to endanger than to protect the public. Unnecessary police intervention, by definition, produces the possibility of conflict where none need exist.* Contrary to the Commonwealth's view, the public will receive its full measure of protection by police who act within the restraints imposed on them by Art. I, § 8 of the Constitution of Pennsylvania and this court's relevant case law. Upon receiving unverified information that a certain person is engaged in illegal activity, the police may always observe the suspect and conduct their own investigation. If police surveillance produces a reasonable suspicion of criminal conduct, the suspect may, of course, be briefly stopped and questioned (the Terry investigative stop),
Commonwealth v. Ortiz
53 Pa.C.S. section 13133. Philadelphia appellants assert that they are limited by the acts of the General Assembly only if those acts are applicable in the entire commonwealth, and the firearms statute is not. In particular, they argue that in Philadelphia County, the legislature requires that a person must be licensed to carry weapons openly and not concealed from sight,*
18 Pa.C.S. section 6108, [footnote 1] whereas in all other counties of Pennsylvania, *weapons may be carried openly without a license*, 18 Pa.C.S. section 6106. [footnote 2]\

Only the Issuing Authority has the Right to Confiscate a Pennsylvania LTCF
§ 6109. Licenses
Revocation.--A license to carry firearms may be revoked by the issuing authority for good cause. A license to carry firearms shall be revoked by the issuing authority for any reason stated in subsection (e)(1) which occurs during the term of the permit. Notice of revocation shall be in writing and shall state the specific reason for revocation. Notice shall be sent by certified mail, and, at that time, a copy shall be forwarded to the commissioner. An individual whose license is revoked shall surrender the license to the issuing authority within five days of receipt of the notice. An individual whose license is revoked may appeal to the court of common pleas for the judicial district in which the individual resides. An individual who violates this section commits a summary offense.
LTCF Only Required if Carrying Concealed or in a Vehicle
§ 6106. Firearms not to be carried without a license.
(a) Offense defined.--Any person who carries a firearm in any vehicle or any person who carries a firearm concealed on or about his person, except in his place of abode or fixed place of business, without a valid and lawfully issued license under this chapter commits a felony of the third degree.

Possible Penalty for Police Actions against a citizens lawful possession of firearms
§ 5301. Official oppression.
A person acting or purporting to act in an official capacity or taking advantage of such actual or purported capacity commits a misdemeanor of the second degree if, knowing that his conduct is illegal, he: subjects another to arrest, detention, search, seizure, mistreatment, dispossession, assessment, lien or other infringement of personal or property rights; or denies or impedes another in the exercise or enjoyment of any right, privilege, power or immunity.

Terroristic threats/Disorderly conduct not applicable to lawful open carrying of a firearm
§ 2706. Terroristic threats.
(a) Offense defined. A person commits the crime of terroristic threats if the person communicates, either directly or indirectly, a threat to: commit any crime of violence with intent to terrorize another; cause evacuation of a building, place of assembly, or facility of public transportation; or otherwise cause serious public inconvenience, or cause terror or serious public inconvenience with reckless disregard of the risk of causing such terror or inconvenience.
(e) Definition.--As used in this section, the term "communicates" means conveys in person or by written or electronic means, including telephone, electronic mail, Internet, facsimile, telex and similar transmissions.§ 5503. Disorderly conduct.
(a) Offense defined.--A person is guilty of disorderly conduct if, with intent to cause public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm, or recklessly creating a risk thereof, he: engages in fighting or threatening, or in violent or tumultuous behavior; makes unreasonable noise; uses obscene language, or makes an obscene gesture; or creates a hazardous or physically offensive condition by any act which serves no legitimate purpose of the actor.

Legitimate purpose Section 21. The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned.

[danp]

Before anyone goes carrying this around it would be really slick if GunLawyer001 or Ruleb10b5 might spot check it if they have some free time.

[billamj]

As far as I'm concerned, while I appreciate all of the work that went into this, I would never present it to a cop in any situation. While I certainly know that it isn't meant to be that way, a lot of folks would take it as being a smartazz and that could end up being an invitation to a proctological exam by a lot of cops.

[danp]

Originally Posted by billamj

As far as I'm concerned, while I appreciate all of the work that went into this, I would never present it to a cop in any situation. While I certainly know that it isn't meant to be that way, a lot of folks would take it as being a smartazz and that could end up being an invitation to a proctological exam by a lot of cops.

If they're already threatening to arrest you for whatever legal activity you were doing you're probably already in that position I would imagine.

[billamj]

Originally Posted by danp

If they're already threatening to arrest you for whatever legal activity you were doing you're probably already in that position I would imagine.

True enough Dan, but you still have the chance to teach them using the legal system and having the charges dropped the second they are filed. If you tick them off by being a smartazz it is amazing how many "illegal" items they can find on or about your person. Maybe your pocket knife looks to be too long or you have what appears to be a "club-like" weapon. Sure, you'll get out of it, after seeing a judge. Bottom line is you can go through a nominal amount of hassle or you can go through extended hassel and getting the rep with some of these local yokels of being a smartazz, always a bad thing.

[LittleRedToyota]

being one of those irrational people who would rather endure a proctological exam than just bite my tongue while my rights are violated (even though it might be a much easier path to just bite my tongue and allow my rights to be violated), i think this is great.

i'll add it to the copy of the PA UFA i already have in my glove compartment.

thanks excel.

[LittleRedToyota]

Originally Posted by billamj

you still have the chance to teach them using the legal system and having the charges dropped the second they are filed.

that might be wishful thinking. there are more than a few DAs out there who don't really give a rat's arse about what the law actually says...some judges, too--especially when it comes to guns.

and, even if the charges are dropped, getting your gun back may not be all that easy either.

[billamj]

Originally Posted by LittleRedToyota

being one of those irrational people who would rather endure a proctological exam than just bite my tongue while my rights are violated (even though it might be a much easier path to just bite my tongue and allow my rights to be violated), i think this is great.

i'll add it to the copy of the PA UFA i already have in my glove compartment.

thanks excel.

Not saying to just take it. After you've gone through the basics and having your legal position proven you do have the opportunity to make them pay for violating your rights. I just like to be a little more on the sly side about how I make my points. Besides if you sue them for violating your rights and one of the cops on that, or another local dept, comes after you they are put against the wall a little more stringently. I just do the nasty in a "nice" way.

[LittleRedToyota]

Originally Posted by billamj

Not saying to just take it. After you've gone through the basics and having your legal position proven you do have the opportunity to make them pay for violating your rights. I just like to be a little more on the sly side about how I make my points. Besides if you sue them for violating your rights and one of the cops on that, or another local dept, comes after you they are put against the wall a little more stringently. I just do the nasty in a "nice" way.

i can see what you're saying. i just have less faith in the judicial system to actually make the right call at any point along the way, so i'll fight for my rights at every point along the way.

after all, the proctology exam might give you even more fuel for your lawsuit.

[exceltoexcel]

If the LEO is going to arrest you or threatens to arrest you this would be a useful tool. If you wait until you are arrested you're going to have to spend some major $$$ to get out of hot water. Also, if you get hassled by the philly police department, which likes to confiscate LTCFs illegally, you can give them this as a warning that they have no authority to do so. Unless, perhaps, you were issued the LTCF from the Philadelphia police.

This is more so for when you site the law, "it is legal to open carry" and anyone proclaims "no its not" . You can say well I have the law in my pocket, here it is. Then when you get those that say terroristic threats / disorderly conduct you can say well i have those laws as well and no they don't apply. Use it if you'd like, don't if you don't want to. I only posted it because others have asked for such a thing and I constantly get told how open carry is illegal by all sorts of numb-nuts then I can show them this rather than saying it is and walking away.
AS for the information contained within, except for the titles of the paragraphs all of it is directly from legal sources. I also have the two supreme court case printed out in full as well as the PA uniform firearms act and the terroristic threats/ disorderly conduct laws. I keep those documents in both of my cars.