Helping a cop in need

[38SnubFan]

Another question. Say the suspect was hurt in the altercation and decided to sue. I would assume that you could be held accountable for that also. I would imagine that the DA or a lawyer working for law enforcement would represent the officer, but would that include the person that helped or would they need their own attorney? That could get expensive fast.

I don't think this would cross anyones mind before they jumped in to help but I'm just wondering what the legal ramifications could be.

Here's the answer to that question, per the PA Crimes Code, and hopefully this should settle a lot of posters' fears regarding legal ramifications regarding assisting a police officer:

Title 18 §508(b)(3)(i & ii):

A private person who assists another private person in effecting an UNLAWFUL arrest, or who, NOT BEING SUMMONED, assists a peace officer in effecting an UNLAWFUL ARREST, is justified in using any force which he/she would be justified in using if the arrest were lawful, if:

(i) he/she believes the arrest is lawful; and
(ii) the arrest would be lawful if the facts were as he/she believes them to be.



Therefore......personally speaking, I would assist an LEO if I see that is he/she is in distress and in need of assistance and backup is not there at that exact moment to assist. Actually, regardless of whether its an LEO or not, I would assist. Like a couple others said: I absolutely cannot sit back and watch someone's life be put in dire jeopardy and still live with myself afterwards for not doing something if/when I have the means to stop a violent attack.

Of course, this is just my opinion, and we all know what opinions are like. Your mileage may vary.

Stay safe and shoot straight,
38SnubFan

[Rule10b5]

Originally Posted by 38SnubFan

Title 18 §508(b)(3)(i & ii):

A private person who assists another private person in effecting an UNLAWFUL arrest, or who, NOT BEING SUMMONED, assists a peace officer in effecting an UNLAWFUL ARREST, is justified in using any force which he/she would be justified in using if the arrest were lawful, if:

(i) he/she believes the arrest is lawful; and
(ii) the arrest would be lawful if the facts were as he/she believes them to be.

Not a panacea.

First, this is a criminal justification statute. It has nothing to do with whether you get sued civilly.

Second, you have no idea what force is justified in what situation. Any idea what the use of force continuum is for the department you're assisting? You know how many cops get sued (and lose) for crossing the line a little bit, even in a lawful arrest? Or how many draw 1983 cases?

[tes151]

Originally Posted by Rule10b5

That's at a bare minimum even to get your phone call returned. If you actually get sued or arrested, count on spending at least $50,000 to get you to trial.

Not sure what I would do. Sure would be hard to just sit and watch another person get hurt or worse when I have the ability to try and help though. As far as getting sued goes, I would be a lot like O.J. Simpson in that, they can file a judgement against me for whatever they want, but that doesn't mean they will ever see a penny of it.

[4XLT]

common sense and humanity, if someone needs help you help there period.

yeah theres allot of what ifs but when its happening you dont think about them you react.

i have in the past helped armed security and police officers alike and every time i have i have been thanks graciously , if its a situation that i believe can be handled by the officer i wont assist unless he asks , the 3 times i have stepped in to help it was obvious the officer/security person were in over their heads and losing the fight...

[HiredGoon]

There was a situation here in PA in the past year or two where a young guy came upon a cop struggling on the ground with a BG and the (unarmed) passerby DID help subdue the guy. I believe the passerby was shot and got a minor injury.

I just can't remember all the details. Did some Googleing, but can't come up with it.

It may have been a State Trooper trying to make the arrest.

I believe it was here in SW PA. Don't remember if the perp got the cop's gun or what.

Anyone else remember this?

[Rule10b5]

Originally Posted by tes151

Not sure what I would do. Sure would be hard to just sit and watch another person get hurt or worse when I have the ability to try and help though. As far as getting sued goes, I would be a lot like O.J. Simpson in that, they can file a judgement against me for whatever they want, but that doesn't mean they will ever see a penny of it.

OJ hasn't paid because he has the kind of money that allows his not to have to pay. He moved his money offshore, gave it to his kids, put it in a house in Florida (which can't be attached), and covers his expenses through irrevocable offshore trusts (over which he, purportedly, has no control or ownership -- ha ha), .

You probably don't have the money to do that -- which means you're screwed if you get a judgment against you.

I certainly don't have enough money to do what he did. And collecting on a judgment isn't about getting paid for some people -- it's about causing the most pain to the person you're trying to collect from as you can.

[DaveM55]

Originally Posted by Pa. Patriot

As such,I will voluntarily reciprocate and return the favor.

Even if it was me?

[angus]

Most of us risk lawsuits every time we get in our vehicles, go to work, cut our grass, walk our dogs or shop in a grocery store. I certainly hope that I will not be paralyzed into morally repugnant act of omission because I fear litigants lurking around every corner.

The question didn't necessarily mean that we use deadly force. Just helping to hold a guy down so the cop can get cuffs on can help.

[Morel42]

When it comes down to it..

Another human being is in danger of being harmed or killed.. If you are in a position to help without undue danger to yourself (say the BG is armed and the officer is already down or unarmed) And you don't help to save your own skin..

Then it's an example of one of the things that's gone wrong with the country.. And ourselves.

Besides, it's the spiderman theory.. The BG gets away, only to break into your house and kill someone you love.. (God I'm a friggin nerd.... )

[knight0334]

Originally Posted by angus

Most of us risk lawsuits every time we get in our vehicles, go to work, cut our grass, walk our dogs or shop in a grocery store. I certainly hope that I will not be paralyzed into morally repugnant act of omission because I fear litigants lurking around every corner.

The question didn't necessarily mean that we use deadly force. Just helping to hold a guy down so the cop can get cuffs on can help.

Exactly.

Most go down with just reasonable force being asserted - IF it even gets to the point of needing force.