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  #11 (permalink)  
Old December 10th, 2007, 11:08 AM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

.357

9MM


9MM 135 grains (charts won't work right)
338 Ftlb


.357 130 grains

575 Ftlb


Damage Control

Last edited by Damage control; December 10th, 2007 at 11:14 AM.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old December 10th, 2007, 11:08 AM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Philadelphia View Post
Do you happen to know the comparative "average" velocities?

This whole "caliber" thing is something on my mind from time to time.

I carry a 9mm.

From what you are saying here, a 9mm JHP that penetrates and expands won't do any less than a .357 that does the same? (but the .357 may leave an exit wound where the 9mm might not?).
I do not know the actual velocities off of the top of my head. They also fluctuate depending on the specific ammo used and the firearm being shot as well.

I'm not saying 9mm won't do any less than the .357. What I'm saying is the difference is marginal and has little to do with how the bullet performs when it comes to incapacitating your target.

This article explains everything. MarcS posts this frequently when these questions come up and it explains it very well.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/pdf/fbi-hwfe.pdf

FWIW I carry 9mm and NEVER feel undergunned. I'll take the advantage of more rounds and quicker follow up shots over a bigger or faster bullet any day. Not to mention it is cheaper to practice with which affords me more practice. You cannot put a value on that.

Last edited by Log9mm; December 10th, 2007 at 11:09 AM. Reason: spelling
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old December 10th, 2007, 11:16 AM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleRedToyota View Post
yeah, i've never been able to figure out just what stopping power is either...

...but, whatever it is, .357mag and .357sig both have more of it than 9mm.

(i carry a 9mm, btw).

.357 mag is more comparable to 10mm than 9mm.
if you don't know what it is, how can you say the .357 has more of it?
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Old December 10th, 2007, 11:18 AM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

I dont know about the rest of you but when I fire my .357 4' revolver with a .357 magnum round, my hand hurts because the bullet is so powerful. I could not imagine firing that round from the snub nose. My semi 9mm is a sub compact and I can fire it all day, my hand wont even get sore. from that, i can say that the .357 seems a lot more powerful.

my advice, pick up a 9mm, fire it. then pick up a .357 and fire it. there is a huge difference. they both can kill though, as can a .22.
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Old December 10th, 2007, 11:26 AM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

Quote:
Originally Posted by WWGunslinger View Post
if you don't know what it is, how can you say the .357 has more of it?
i was joking around, but trying to say...

1. all handguns are prone to not stopping threats.

2. the ballistic difference between .357 and 9mm is pretty much irrelevant compared to shot placement which is key. quick follow-up shots are more important than "stopping power" (whatever that is), etc.

3. however, if you look at the ballistics numbers (as some others have posted in this thread)...velocity, energy, etc. the .357 "wins"...now, do those numbers actually mean anything significant?

i guess in a nutshell, i was saying...i think the OP was prolly really asking which had better ballistic numbers...in which case the answer is .357. however, those numbers to not necessarily equate to "stopping power".
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Old December 10th, 2007, 11:30 AM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

Quote:
Originally Posted by rspowers View Post
I dont know about the rest of you but when I fire my .357 4' revolver with a .357 magnum round, my hand hurts because the bullet is so powerful. I could not imagine firing that round from the snub nose. My semi 9mm is a sub compact and I can fire it all day, my hand wont even get sore. from that, i can say that the .357 seems a lot more powerful.

my advice, pick up a 9mm, fire it. then pick up a .357 and fire it. there is a huge difference. they both can kill though, as can a .22.

I think there's a big difference between power and perceived recoil. A S&W airweight snubby chambered in .38 special is gonna kick a lot more than a subcompact auto in 9mm, but the 9mm is certainly the more powerful round of the two.
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Old December 10th, 2007, 12:32 PM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

Quote:
Originally Posted by rspowers View Post
I dont know about the rest of you but when I fire my .357 4' revolver with a .357 magnum round, my hand hurts because the bullet is so powerful. I could not imagine firing that round from the snub nose. My semi 9mm is a sub compact and I can fire it all day, my hand wont even get sore. from that, i can say that the .357 seems a lot more powerful.

my advice, pick up a 9mm, fire it. then pick up a .357 and fire it. there is a huge difference. they both can kill though, as can a .22.
Yea but all that extra power just equates to the bullet moving faster, seeing as they are for all intents and purposes the same sized bullet. If 9mm has sufficient penetration to incapacitate, then the same bullet moving faster could border on over penetration. Do not get me wrong I think the .357 round is a great self defence round, but to say it has more stopping power because it travels a greater distance after it goes through you does not add up in my opinion. Also you must take note of what Cheeseybacon said. Percieved recoil is not to be confused with power. If that were the case my 442 (airweight snub chambered in .38 special) would be the most powerfull gun in my collection. And that is not the case.

Last edited by Log9mm; December 10th, 2007 at 12:33 PM. Reason: misspelled cheeseybacon's name
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Old December 10th, 2007, 12:49 PM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

if the .357 travels faster(harder), and is nearly the same size, wouldnt that mean it has more stopping power?

For example, when I used to play baseball when I was a kid, if I got hit with a ball traveling 35 mph, it wouldnt even push me, but when I got hit with a ball traveling 50mph, it would knock me down. I know this isnt exactly the same, but if something is traveling faster, and is the same size, its impact would push something farther and harder. Another example could be Having someone push you lightly and see if you can stand still, then have them push you harder and see if you move. Its the same principle under extreme circumstances. The velocity of the bullets may not be much of a difference, but is the difference significant? without empirical evidence, we dont know, but we can say that its at least greater....based on the info provided here. I have not actually seen any studies on this.

also, when I was talking about recoil, i was saying that the recoil on a 4 inch revolver firing a .357 is much greater than a subcompact semi 9mm which would mean that if I fired the 9mm from the revolver(although impossible) it would be much less or recoil.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old December 10th, 2007, 01:05 PM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

Quote:
Originally Posted by rspowers View Post
if the .357 travels faster(harder), and is nearly the same size, wouldnt that mean it has more stopping power?
maybe not. maybe it travels so fast it goes right through the guy. thus, it does not deposit all of it's energy in the guy...and thus deposits less energy than the other round and therefore has less "stopping power".

or maybe the bullets are shaped differently, and, thus, cause a different type of wound.

etc.

that's the problem...what, exactly, constitutes "stopping power"?

and, given that all handguns are notoriously bad at immediately stopping people, does it really matter which has more "stopping power"?

Quote:
Its the same principle under extreme circumstances.
actually, it isn't. there are many factors that come into play when considering the damage done to a body by a bullet that don't come into play when talking about getting hit with a baseball or someone pushing you.

Quote:
also, when I was talking about recoil, i was saying that the recoil on a 4 inch revolver firing a .357 is much greater than a subcompact semi 9mm which would mean that if I fired the 9mm from the revolver(although impossible) it would be much less or recoil.
i don't think that is a valid conclusion. i don't think you can imagine what firing a 9mm out of a revolver would be like based on firing a 9mm out of a similar sized semi-auto.

for one thing, the ergonomics of a revolver are considerably different from the ergonomics of a semi-auto. the shape of the grip is different, the bore axis is different, the material the frame is made out of might be different, the weight of the gun is different, the semi-auto has a relatively heavy slide that moves and thereby absorbs energy, etc. etc.

it really is apples and oranges.

(btw, other than a .44mag, the handgun that i have shot that had the worst "kick" was a little .380 semi-auto...and .380 is definitely not a powerful round.)

Last edited by LittleRedToyota; December 10th, 2007 at 01:08 PM.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old December 10th, 2007, 01:09 PM
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Default Re: .357 vs 9mm

This subject has been around for many a year. SHOT PLACEMENT IS THE
KEY TO ANY CALIBER. If you would like research the subject more extensively,
GOOGLE: RELATIVE INCAPACITATING INDEX.
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