Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association Discussion Forum

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-   Concealed & Open Carry (http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-open-carry-121/)
-   -   READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania (http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-open-carry-121/7582-read-first-where-you-can-cannot-carry-weapons-state-pennsylvania.html)

knight0334 April 12th, 2011 08:13 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BimmerJon (Post 1560984)
Knight: would the following benefit from some rewording?

someone that is not well read may interpret that as "I can carry loaded if I'm going to the range. Loaded or unloaded makes no difference"

I know they would read and find out about it needing to be unloaded without a LTCF... But if they stopped reading after the bold, an assumption could be made. Just a thought

Some people assume that so long as the handgun is unloaded that they can transport it for any reason, especially for just open carry purposes.

However, I will add that if you have a license that you can carry it loaded.

9orangeletters May 3rd, 2011 09:59 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
I'm a little confused about the "no guns" signage.

For example, you have a plot of land adjacent to a roadway that is private property. There is only ONE (1) way in, and it has signage, welcoming horse riders, ATV riders, Fishermen, Runners, Bikers, Canadians and the French, but has a sign like this one:
http://notinkansasanymoretoto.typepa...f74c970b-800wi
Am I to assume that this sign is not enough to create "defiant trespass"? Would the sign then have to be more akin to:
http://www.mydoorsign.com/img/lg/S/N...ign-S-4913.gif
I'm confused as to what delinquentes caveo or whatever even MEANS, since I don't speak latin.

knight0334 May 3rd, 2011 10:22 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 9orangeletters (Post 1584524)
I'm a little confused about the "no guns" signage.

For example, you have a plot of land adjacent to a roadway that is private property. There is only ONE (1) way in, and it has signage, welcoming horse riders, ATV riders, Fishermen, Runners, Bikers, Canadians and the French, but has a sign like this one:
http://notinkansasanymoretoto.typepa...f74c970b-800wi
Am I to assume that this sign is not enough to create "defiant trespass"? Would the sign then have to be more akin to:
http://www.mydoorsign.com/img/lg/S/N...ign-S-4913.gif
I'm confused as to what delinquentes caveo or whatever even MEANS, since I don't speak latin.

A sign the spells it out, or displays a condition in the form of a picture is sufficient enough. It just has a minimum requirement that the sign be posted in a manner likely to be noticed by those entering the property. It could certainly be argued that the wording or depiction must be understandable to a layman.

That sign would be sufficient for Defiant Trespass. As a landowner you can create conditions to be on properties. Posting of those conditions creates the staging for "privilege". You must be an invited or expect guest(actual consent), or have implied consent, have legal lease or be a tenant, to have "privilege." Without privilege you have no right to be on another's property, so if the landowner posts a sign stating "no guns" in words or depiction to which a layman can understand it, and it is in a place that would likely be seen, and you violate that condition - you are trespassing.

delinquentes caveo = transgressors beware. Transgress is a joint form of ingress and egress combined. To come and go, to enter and to leave..

studderingdave May 5th, 2011 11:40 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
I know this topic has been done to death, but i got conflicting opinion today about CC in a bar. I NEVER go to bars, i am 29 years old and do not drink, but i am graduating saturday and will be tagging along with my graduating class on a "bar crawl". i don't plan on drinking but i do plan on carrying a concealed weapon.

It is in Stroudsburg PA, I just want to be clear on this, i CAN conceal carry in bars right?

Connal May 5th, 2011 11:47 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by studderingdave (Post 1587006)
I know this topic has been done to death, but i got conflicting opinion today about CC in a bar. I NEVER go to bars, i am 29 years old and do not drink, but i am graduating saturday and will be tagging along with my graduating class on a "bar crawl". i don't plan on drinking but i do plan on carrying a concealed weapon.

It is in Stroudsburg PA, I just want to be clear on this, i CAN conceal carry in bars right?

Yes, unless there is a sign clearly posted with some "private property" rule, you are legally allowed to carry in an establishment that serves alcohol in PA.

RickySinatra May 10th, 2011 09:32 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
I have a quick question, and forgive me if it has been answered. This forum has so much in it. I am working on getting my LTCF in Philadelphia, Now. I am in Retail and just the other day, in fact, on Mother's Day My store was held up at gunpoint. I'm thankful I was not the one who was robbed because Frankly I would have shot the Man. I thought I read somewhere before that since I'm the Manager at this location basically acting owner and I have the owners concent I am allowed to have my gun in the store. But can I carry it on me in store?? Open or Concealed? also... suppose one of my employees used it while I was not there. Do I go to Jail?

Thanks in Advance,

Rick

General Geoff May 10th, 2011 09:35 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
I seem to recall some fairly esoteric case law that states only those who have an actual stake (i.e. ownership status) in a business are considered to be at their fixed place of business for purposes of carrying a firearm concealed without a license. I'll see if I can dig it up for you...


edit; found it

WhiteFeather June 14th, 2011 11:23 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BimmerJon (Post 1560984)
Knight: would the following benefit from some rewording?

Openly or concealed does NOT matter to vehicles, nor does its loaded or unloaded status, only the fact that there is a "firearm"(handgun, SBS, SBR) in, on, or upon a vehicle. Any device that is used to transport people is a vehicle. Yes, that includes horses, bicycles, motorcycles, boats, trains, airplanes, cars, trucks, trolleys, etc, etc. YOU NEED A LICENSE TO TRANSPORT A HANDGUN IN, ON, OR UPON A VEHICLE UNLESS YOU ARE GOING TO/FROM ONE OF THE EXEMPTED LOCATIONS IN 18.61.6106.(B).

someone that is not well read may interpret that as "I can carry loaded if I'm going to the range. Loaded or unloaded makes no difference"

I know they would read and find out about it needing to be unloaded without a LTCF... But if they stopped reading after the bold, an assumption could be made. Just a thought

Many of you might have missed this thread directly dealing with getting rid of this silly NO STOP with unloaded firearm in current PA law.

2011-12 Getting rid of NO STOPS clause with the transportation of gun w/o LTCF
http://forum.pafoa.org/pennsylvania-...-w-o-ltcf.html

If you don't like having to deal with this stupid requirement in the existing PA law with no stops unless you have a LTCF permit.

How about helping to change the law by contacting the Reps

Details in that thread on this Activist effort as of June 14, 2011 we have 96 out of 203 sponsors in the house.

B2Luv2Hunt June 16th, 2011 05:15 AM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by anie (Post 1630392)
Whenever I go to the malls for shopping I never carry conceal items with me because that one is restricted area......... So I suggest you to don't carry conceal item with you at that places

Malls are not a restricted area in PA. They may have a no guns policy as private property but not all Malls in PA have that policy.

WWGunslinger July 14th, 2011 03:56 PM

Re: READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania
 
Yikes! I didn't realize that you couldn't have a loaded rifle in the vehicle or even couldn't have loaded mags in the same container (case) even with an LTCF.


I've never transported a rifle loaded, but have always kept the loaded mags in the same case with the rifle.

I assume that pockets on the outside of the case are still considered the same case or is that ok?


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