IF YOU HAVE A BEER AND ARE CARRYING...

[Steve in PA]

Originally Posted by cznut

the law states that you CANNOT carry when drinking alcohol or carry into ANY facility that sells alcohol. Got it from the Sheriffs department today, on paper and am looking at it while I type.

There is no such law in Pennsylvania. Anyone, including the sheriff who tells you different has no idea what they are talking about.

[Steve in PA]

Originally Posted by Skuggi

You know what, I'm getting so fucking sick and god damn tired of sheriffs making their own god damn laws, why is the AG not prosecuting these ass tards... They just get away with making up their own shit, like they're king or something WTF.

I'm wondering if there is anyway that we can form a case against these SOB's.

The sheriffs do it because they "think" they know what they are talking about. I've said it before, its really sad that the people you have to go to (sheriffs) in order to get your CCW have very little knowledge about any of the gun laws.

[JayBell]

Steve, the more i read your posts, the more respect i have for ya

It's also good to know there's at least ONE Professional LEO in PA that knows what the hell he's enforcing

[Emptymag]

Originally Posted by JayBell

Steve, the more i read your posts, the more respect i have for ya

It's also good to know there's at least ONE Professional LEO in PA that knows what the hell he's enforcing

Agreed!

Steve,
I respect your AUTHOR-I-TIE!

[BearTitan]

I don't think that I should have to give up my right to carry firearms just because I choose to excercise my right to consume alcohol. Driving a vehicle is a priveledge, so it is a different ball game. I do not support drinking excessively while armed, but agree that all of us have the right to do so. Because someone wants to get drunk, I don't believe he should need to be defenseless while doing it.

We don't always like when the other guy excercises his rights. Especially if it makes us feel uncomfortable. NineSeven wrote an awesome post about this http://www.pafoa.org/forum/general-2...amendment.html

[NineseveN]

Some good opinions all around. For what it's worth, here's my take on it.


I drink and carry on the rare occassion (don't drink much these days really), never with the intent to get totally drunk, but I will be completely honest and say that I have had a pretty good buzz (unintentional or intentional is of no matter) while carrying before. Was I still completely in control of myself? Absolutely. Did I have my fine motor skills at the time? Not completely. Was I prone to just whip out my gun and start shooting up the place? Of course not, I don't think that I'd ever get that silly drunk in public anyway (carrying or not).

As far as the theory that you will get convicted if you have to shoot someone when you've been drinking. First, if the imminent threat was true and clear, it's a good shoot. Now, there are some grey area instances where it may act against you, but no more (or not much) than it would if you were on prescription medication, just lost your job, having troubles with the wife/SO etc...

A zealous DA will use ANYTHING he or she can, drinking, drugs, cough medicine, a history of violence when you were in the 7th grade, home or work problems or whatever.

Now, where it may really hurt you is in a civil suit, but since there really is no solid formula for winning civil suits, you really cannot plan to mitigate all of the wild and preposterous reasons why a civil jury would take your money from you and give it to the assailant or their family.

I'd much rather have to face a jury/judge and explain why I felt comfortable having 4-5 beers over a few hours while out than ending up dead and wishing I had a gun, drunk or not. As the old saying goes, either way, you pays yer money, you takes yer chances.

[Steve in PA]

LOL......thanks guys.

A few years ago, my dept tried getting depts on either side of us to come and do firearms quals with us. They basically did the shoot the qual course, see ya next year type thing. I had a copy of their firearms policy so that I could quiz them on their standards and policy. Their policy was actually very good, just that they didn't have the time, etc to implement alot of it.

Anyway, one of their policies covera alcohol and off-duty carry. I'm trying to remember it off the top of my head as I haven't found the copy yet, but as long as their BAC is under the legal limit for driving a vehicle (0.10% at the time) they are within their dept standards.

There are no alcohol standards for anyone, including police officers carrying firearms. We as police officers are however governed by standards and policies that the average citizen is not. I personally don't drink when I carry, mainly because I'm not that much of a drinker. I'm not professing that this is the only way to go, just that its my personal preference not to drink.

[kimbercdp]

Shooting someone in self defense would be a huge pain in the arz, legal wise. Having a buzz on and shooting someone, well, your just asking for it, and I'm sure you'll get it. Pucker up baby, your boyfriend is callin!

[BearTitan]

Frankly, I don't see what alcohol has to do with if a shoot is legit or not.

Self defense is self defense. What is the difference if I am attacked in the parking lot of a bar on Saturday night or if I am attacked in the parking lot of my church on Sunday morning. The fact that I may have alcohol in my system in the first example does not change the facts of the case in any way. Was my life in danger, did I try to escape, was appropriate force used? A good shoot is a good shoot and a bad shoot is a bad shoot.

You can be sued for anything. I refuse to give up one of my inalienable rights to avoid a law suit. It's the old..."I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6".

[kimbercdp]

Good point and well said.