State line question on the river.

[CcDesign]

The other day I had stopped by to see a friend who lives on the Delaware River in Lower Bucks County. When i got there he was down at the dock cleaning his boat. I hopped on the boat and started general bullshitting. A little while latter a NJ marine officer came by in his launch within ten yards of my buddies boat. I had a firearm on me (concealed) but really thought nothing of it at the time. The LEO just cruised on by with nothing more than a wave.

After thinking about it a bit, what would be the ramifications (if any) of a NJ LEO finding me on the PA shoreline with a concealed weapon? Do they even have jurisdiction to be patrolling the PA side? I would have to assume that the shorline along each state, belongs to said state. I know that NJ is near a communist state when it comes to firearms.

[knight0334]

So long as you are on PA terra firma, he cant do anything about your gun.

They can enforce fishing requirements due to a reciprocal agreement for licensing. Its possible that even some boating laws/regs can be enforced as well.

[CcDesign]

So long as you are on PA terra firma, he cant do anything about your gun.

Does being in boat floating on the river constitute 'terra firma"?

[knight0334]

There is no doubt about being on PA dry land and carrying a gun that the NJ LEO couldn't do anything. Boats, I don't know all the boating laws and what agreements we may have with NJ.

One thing is for sure though, under PA law you cannot have a loaded gun on a motorized boat or sail boat, until it's engine is stopped or sail furled and forward momentum has ceased.

Without any agreement with NJ as a factor, so long as you stay west of the center of the Delaware River or on the PA side of any variances - PA's law would apply.

[308man]

What if you are a ZRT navy ship on patrol protecting the shores?

[knight0334]

Originally Posted by 308man

What if you are a ZRT navy ship on patrol protecting the shores?

I dont think either PA or NJ recognizes, or sanctions, the Zombie Response Team Navy. If they did, both PA and NJ would have to quarantine about 95% of the NJ residents from the rest of the USA.

[God's Country]

Originally Posted by knight0334

One thing is for sure though, under PA law you cannot have a loaded gun on a motorized boat or sail boat, until it's engine is stopped or sail furled and forward momentum has ceased.

So if I'm fishing on any body of water in a boat that has either a gas or electric motor my ltcf does not apply? The same as off road vehicles?

[Sandcut]

I believe it's usually the center line of the channel that separates the state boundaries. With that said, you need to stay aware by looking at maps and/or charts.

I know that there is an area south of Philly near the Delaware Bay where there is a tiny section of Delaware that is on the eastern side (NJ side) of the waterway. I'm not aware of anything like this between PA and NJ.

I do know that when permitting work on bridge piers spanning the Delaware, the bridge owners have to deal with BOTH PA and NY/NJ DEPs depending on where the pier is located within the channel. The State claims ownership of the submerged lands beneath the waterway.

I'd say the NJ warden was out of his area if he's on the PA side of the river. The reciprocity in fishing regs is to prevent fishermen from having to worry about being 3' over the state line. I do not believe that it extends NJ criminal jurisdiction to the high water line on the PA side.

[323Power]

Originally Posted by knight0334

One thing is for sure though, under PA law you cannot have a loaded gun on a motorized boat or sail boat, until it's engine is stopped or sail furled and forward momentum has ceased.

Can you cite the source of that? I'm curious. You'd think it'd be mentioned here:

http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-ope...nsylvania.html (READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania)

[knight0334]

Originally Posted by 323Power

Can you cite the source of that? I'm curious. You'd think it'd be mentioned here:

http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-ope...nsylvania.html (READ FIRST: Where you CAN and CANNOT Carry weapons in the State of Pennsylvania)

Sure:

http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/v...&q=151112#2503

Sec. 2503. Loaded firearms in vehicles.

(a) General rule. - Except as otherwise provided in this title, it is unlawful for any person to have a firearm of any kind in or on or against any conveyance propelled by mechanical power or its attachments at any time whether or not the vehicle or its attachment is in motion unless the firearm is unloaded.

(b) Exceptions. - This section shall not be construed to apply to:
(5) Any motorboat or other craft having a motor attached or any sailboat if the motor has been completely shut off or the sail furled and its progress therefrom has ceased.

Also, here is the reciprocal code for NY and NJ to enforce certain laws:
http://www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/v...8&q=151035#908

Title 34, Chapter 9, Subchapter A:

Sec. 908. Reciprocal enforcement on Delaware River.

So long as the State of New York or the State of New Jersey, as the case may be, has in effect a statutory provision analogous to this section, any person who is authorized to enforce this title or an officer of a reciprocating state may enforce this title on any part of the Delaware River between those states or on the shores of that river.