Got pulled over today – informed the officer of my gun and permit

[NineseveN]

Okay, details first:

I was guilty, no arguing that. I blew a red light (along with the vehicle in front of me). It's no excuse to say that I was paying attention to the car and not the light, and when they went through, I followed.

I don't blame the cop for stopping me and not the other car, after all, if that car was guilty, I was even more so if only due to the fact that I was behind him, so the light was red even longer.

I don't feel that there was any danger, no other traffic was moving at the time, all were still stopped at their red lights (I always look for traffic regardless), so the light had just changed. I only knew it was a red light because I looked in the rear view mirror at the intersection and when the cop flipped his lights and the cars were already moving. Due to the timing, I knew right then what I did. I drove a few hundred feet to find a safe place to pull over.


As I stopped the car and put it in park, I found myself recalling the words of caution and warning given by many forum members here about telling the cops you're armed when it's not legally required that you do so. I've been pulled over plenty of time before (mostly speeding on the highway), and I've always volunteered that information, which usually got me out of a ticket or at least ensured that no points were assessed on the citation. I decided I wouldn't tell the officer that I was carrying unless he asked. I rolled my window down, turned the ignition off, put the keys on the dash and hung my hands out of the window as I always do.

However, as soon as he got to the window, I realized that he would undoubtedly ask for my registration, which is in the glove box, which also houses a .357magnum revolver. When he asked for my license and registration, I provided the ID and then informed him that I was licensed to carry a concealed firearm in the commonwealth and that I had a loaded .357 in the glove box, which is where my registration also happened to be. I asked how he wanted me to proceed.

The officer showed no concern or fright, he just asked that I step out of the car, walk around to the other side with him while he secured the gun and retrieved my registration for me. I often have a gun in the glove box, and this was the first time any police officer has asked me out of the car, normally they just ask me to open the box slowly, get the registration and close the box while they watched. I started thinking maybe there was something to the cautionary warnings that some people give here.

The officer retrieved my registration and my gun, unloaded the cylinder and said he was going to take it back to his car, but that I could get back in my vehicle to keep warm (it's like -15 degrees out here today). Of course, I knew that he would undoubtedly run the serial number on the gun, such would be pretty customary even if I don't necessarily agree with it. As he was walking away, he turned and said, “you do know why I pulled you over, right?”, to which I replied, “oh yeah, I blew that red light, my fault, I was just in a hurry and following the other car”.

Anyway, he comes back to my car with my information and my gun in a little less than 5 minutes, hands everything to me and gives me my ticket. He thanked me twice for letting him know about the gun, saying that normally people don't think and just go reaching for things or something to that effect.

Anyway, I got nailed with a $108 fine and 3 points, which I'll plead not guilty to and try to get the points taken off (don't much care about the fine though, I did it).


So I've come away from this going back to my original thoughts on the issue; everyone should make their own choices, but if I'm getting pulled over and I already know I broke the law, there's simply no sense in not telling the officer about a gun that he might find anyway. All that does is endanger good will and common courtesy. I've been pulled over 9 times as I recall since I started carrying, I've always informed and never had a problem. This is the first time my gun has left my vehicle or my possession.

These warnings from others are indeed something to consider, but I've found that each individual determines the response that the LEO will have. It's not just how you look (I'm 6' 2”, shaved head, goatee, 220lbs and look like a biker half the time), it's also how you communicate and how well you put others at ease around you. I'm so calm, when I go to sleep, sheep count me.

Someone that has an interior dislike of law enforcement, or someone that gets freaked out, nervous, agitated or aggravated when being pulled over will probably not have such an easy time. I communicate pretty well and I'm 100% non-confrontational. I figure if there's a time to argue my case, on the side of the road ain't it...that's what court and lawyers are for. If the officer had asked to search my vehicle, I would not have given consent. If the officer had wanted to cuff me for some reason, I would comply, but I would never give consent. But to me, informing the officer that I am armed as a matter of courtesy is good sense, especially based on the experiences I've had. Every positive experience a cop has with a gun owner is a chance to help put their minds at ease when dealing with LTCF holders and gun owners in general. If, at some future time, I am proned out on the ground and/or tackled by SWAT for informing an officer that I am licensed and carrying, I might start to reconsider this, but I think all the noise about this is much ado about nothing.

[sgt7546]

Sorry to here about your ticket, I hope you can get the points knocked off. As for your handling of the situation, I give your the utmost respect.

[Philadelphia]

It's unfortunate that exercising your second amendment rights means you no longer have fourth amendments rights. Anyplace your lawfully possessed gun happens to be is apparently now fair game for unreasonable search and seizure by the gov't (search of your glovebox, seizure of your gun, search of your serial number). As far as I can tell, you did not knowingly and voluntarily consent to any of these acts and they were all illegal.

[KeithPA]

Originally Posted by Philadelphia

It's unfortunate that exercising your second amendment rights means you no longer have fourth amendments rights. Anyplace your lawfully possessed gun happens to be is apparently now fair game for unreasonable search and seizure by the gov't (search of your glovebox, seizure of your gun, search of your serial number). As far as I can tell, you did not knowingly and voluntarily consent to any of these acts and they were all illegal.

Good thought!



I assume your gun was bought here in PA and would show up in the States Non-Registry Gun Registry?

[NineseveN]

Originally Posted by sgt7546

Sorry to here about your ticket, I hope you can get the points knocked off. As for your handling of the situation, I give your the utmost respect.

The best part about it, today's my birthday. The irony is killing me.

[NineseveN]

Originally Posted by DeltaII5

I assume your gun was bought here in PA and would show up in the States Non-Registry Gun Registry?

Yep. I caught some radio chatter when the other officer showed up, seems they couldn't find a gun with that serial number at first. I was thinking, oh god, here we go. Turns out it was no big deal. He had already put it back on my dashboard and was almost turning away when the radio bleeped out "We got it, the gun is registered to your operator".

After I get the points taken off, I'm going to look into ways to pursue that a little and see what the deal was with that.

[sgt7546]

97, a lot of times, the Officer isn't running the gun for ownership, he is running it for stolen. The "no record found" is music to my ears.

[larrymeyer]

Originally Posted by Philadelphia

It's unfortunate that exercising your second amendment rights means you no longer have fourth amendments rights. Anyplace your lawfully possessed gun happens to be is apparently now fair game for unreasonable search and seizure by the gov't (search of your glovebox, seizure of your gun, search of your serial number). As far as I can tell, you did not knowingly and voluntarily consent to any of these acts and they were all illegal.

In the OP I don't think he said the LEO searched the glove compartment. Maybe he should have just opened the glove compartment and taken the gun out without notifying the officer. This LEO doesn't know you from Adam. You maybe a serial killer. Tell me you'd just let someone pull a gun on you if you didn't know them

[God's Country]

Personally, I think you did the right thing considering the facts as to the location of the weapon. If it were on my person I would not have volunteered that information unless asked to step out of the vehicle, then I would likely play it by ear, but who knows, since it's never happened to me.

[gnbrotz]

Originally Posted by larrymeyer

In the OP I don't think he said the LEO searched the glove compartment.

Call it what you want, it was a "search". If there had been some weed or coke in there too, do you think it would have been ignored, since the officer was simply 'securing the firearm', not 'searching the glovebox'?

I won't criticize the OP's decisions at all, but a potential situation like this is why I keep my vehicle documents within reach of the driver's seat, and would never keep a firearm in the glovebox. It's either on my person, or secured in a lockbox inside the passenger compartment, but out of sight.