PA Constable Arrested by NYPD for Concealed Carry???

[Steve in PA]

As for the MPOETC Qual Course......a dept is not required to use that course, although I'm sure most do.

The dept must use a course that meets the following;

"A handgun course of fire must be considered a generally accepted police qualification course consisting of at least fifty (50) rounds of duty ammunition. A minimum of ten (10%) percent of the rounds must be fired at a distance of 25 yards or greater.

The course shall include stages to determine the applicant's or officers' overall proficiency; including, but not limited to marksmanship, safety, weapon operating procedures or tactical skills (i.e., use of cover, tactical reloading), with the weapon s/he will use in the performance of their duties. Requirements for distances of firing positions are: Stages no closer than one (1) yard and at least one stage of fire from the twenty-five (25) yard line or greater distance."

There are many instructors, myself included that go way above and beyond MPOETC's requirments.

[MSOfin]

Originally Posted by nlcrsn

I really thought this site would bring more intelligent conversation.
1. Any time the news sensationalizes an incident w/ a firearm pro 2A Americans get upset about it.
2. Usually when some1 on this site hears a rumor they research (COMPLETELY) b4 judging.
3. Constables are LEO's! @ present they do not have training in traffic/ pursuits/ pursuit driving or emergency vehicle operations. So no we are not permitted to run lights *( as Constables) see # 4
4. There are many Police Officers/ Sheriffs / aka LEO, that are Constables.
5. One bad apple does not make the whole tree rotten.
6. YES, I am a Pa. State Constable!
7. No, I personally don't want lights, traffic duties. But lights would be useful in many situations! IE.. I, (as do most constables) have stopped to offer assistance to other LEO's in many situations.
8. There are reasons and times for us to be out of state, with proper paper work. which he most likely had because he wasn't charged with the many available charges that could run with not following procedure.
9.I cannot speak as to why he did not notify local authorities

Interesting article, reiterating what nlcrsn stated above, Pa Constables are LEO. Techniquely Pa Constables are sworn Peace Officers of the Commonwealth. If you have a chance to look through the Pa Crime Codes you will notice the term 'Sworn Peace Officer' is used rather than 'Police Officer'. In Pa, all Police Officers are sworn Peace Officers, but not all sworn Peace Officers are Police Officers (Ex. being Constables and Public Safety Officers).

I do find it very interesting that Constables are not permitted to run lights and siren. I say this b/c PSP Act 235 Agents are eligible to be sworn as Peace Officers through the Night Watchman Act. These Agents (yes, I am one )receive less training than a constable yet I see PSP 235 Agents running lights on their privately owned patrol vehicles (red and blues).

Please forgive for playing Devil's advocate for a few minutes. I'm wondering why Sheriff's radio cars are permitted (let's say before 2007) are permitted to run lights and sirens on their radio cars? Sheriffs (my understanding) and Deputies do not have to attend Act 120 school ( the 'Police Academy') and are lacking the same educational courses constables are (such as driving and traffic stops). Since sheriffs and Constables share similar responsibilities, why where the sheriffs permitted to run lights and siren while Constables where prohibited?

I am seriously considering taking the Constable course work this summer. I certainly am very interested in reading the posts to follow

[MSOfin]

Originally Posted by Steve in PA

Since you keep bringing it up, I'd really like to hear what is so special about constables firearms training, especially the "in depth & demanding" part.

The few that I have seen at the range have a hard time hitting the target.

I am unsure on the details, but feel very confident in stating Constables must complete 4o hours of basic weapon training before being allowed to carry on the job.

[Steve in PA]

Act 235 officers are NOT allowed to run the combination of red & blue lights on public roads of the Commonwealth. They may run them on the private roads of the developments where they work.

As for the sheriffs, they are by definition "emergency vehicles" and authorized to run red & blue lights along with a siren.

§ 4571. Visual and audible signals on emergency vehicles

(a) General rule.--Every emergency vehicle shall be equipped with one or more revolving or flashing red lights and an audible warning system. Spotlights with adjustable sockets may be attached to or mounted on emergency vehicles.

(b) Police, sheriff, fire and coroner or medical examiner vehicles.--

(1) Police, sheriff, coroner, medical examiner or fire police vehicles may in addition to the requirements of subsection (a) be equipped with one or more revolving or flashing blue lights. The combination of red and blue lights may be used only on police, sheriff, coroner, medical examiner or fire police vehicles.

(2) Unmarked police and sheriff vehicles used as emergency vehicles and equipped with audible warning systems shall be equipped with the lights described in this subsection.


(b.1) Mounted lights and additional equipment.--

(1) Police, sheriff and fire vehicles may be equipped with a mounted rack containing one or more emergency warning lights or side mounted floodlights or alley lights or all such lights in conformance with department regulations.

(2) Additional visual or audible warning signal equipment, including, but not limited to, flashing headlamp system, flashing or revolving white or clear lights, steady burning lights, traffic-control emergency directional light assembly, amber lights and intersection lights, may be utilized on emergency vehicles in accordance with regulations promulgated by the department.

Nothing says a person has to be Act 120 certified in order to opoerate a vehicle equipped with lights & sirens.

Constables also do not have access to CLEAN or NCIC information. One of our councilmen is a constable and this is one of his frequent gripes.

[lildobe]

Originally Posted by Steve in PA

§ 4571. Visual and audible signals on emergency vehicles

Which chapter is this from? I can't find it (then again pacode.com is sorely lacking), and it'd be very useful for an endeavor that myself and several other people are working on right now.

[Steve in PA]

Its from the PA Vehicle Code Title 75, Part IV: Vehicle Characteristics, Chapter 45: Other Related Equipment, Subchapter D: Equipment of Authorized and Emergency Vehicles.

[lildobe]

Originally Posted by Steve in PA

Its from the PA Vehicle Code Title 75, Part IV: Vehicle Characteristics, Chapter 45: Other Related Equipment, Subchapter D: Equipment of Authorized and Emergency Vehicles.

Thank You!

[knighthawk06699]

He is a constable it is an entirely different ball game.

[MSOfin]

Originally Posted by Steve in PA

Act 235 officers are NOT allowed to run the combination of red & blue lights on public roads of the Commonwealth. They may run them on the private roads of the developments where they work.

As for the sheriffs, they are by definition "emergency vehicles" and authorized to run red & blue lights along with a siren.

§ 4571. Visual and audible signals on emergency vehicles

(a) General rule.--Every emergency vehicle shall be equipped with one or more revolving or flashing red lights and an audible warning system. Spotlights with adjustable sockets may be attached to or mounted on emergency vehicles.

(b) Police, sheriff, fire and coroner or medical examiner vehicles.--

(1) Police, sheriff, coroner, medical examiner or fire police vehicles may in addition to the requirements of subsection (a) be equipped with one or more revolving or flashing blue lights. The combination of red and blue lights may be used only on police, sheriff, coroner, medical examiner or fire police vehicles.

(2) Unmarked police and sheriff vehicles used as emergency vehicles and equipped with audible warning systems shall be equipped with the lights described in this subsection.


(b.1) Mounted lights and additional equipment.--

(1) Police, sheriff and fire vehicles may be equipped with a mounted rack containing one or more emergency warning lights or side mounted floodlights or alley lights or all such lights in conformance with department regulations.

(2) Additional visual or audible warning signal equipment, including, but not limited to, flashing headlamp system, flashing or revolving white or clear lights, steady burning lights, traffic-control emergency directional light assembly, amber lights and intersection lights, may be utilized on emergency vehicles in accordance with regulations promulgated by the department.

Nothing says a person has to be Act 120 certified in order to opoerate a vehicle equipped with lights & sirens.

Constables also do not have access to CLEAN or NCIC information. One of our councilmen is a constable and this is one of his frequent gripes.

All of this is correct, I wasn't as clear as I intended to be. The two departments where the PSP 235 Agents run red and blues are 'Public Safety Departments' and do have Peace Officer status through the Night Watchman Act.

From what I read here it seems Constables are not permitted to run lights as they do not receive driving training. We all know all Pa Constables are sworn Peace Officers of the commonwealth, BUT a Sheriff or Deputy does not have to be a sworn Peace Officer to perform the duties of said office. IMO, the ability too run lights should be based on the status of the individual utilizing the vehicle, not the decal on the door. I believe sworn Peace Officers should be permitted to run lights and siren regardless if they are Police, Sheriff, Constable, or Public Safety. I would also like to see one day that all Sheriffs and Deputies must complete Act 120 or Sheriff equivalent training to perform duties in said office.

[Steve in PA]

The sheriffs academy is pretty similar to Act 120, the major difference being they do not enforce the vehicle code.

Some sheriffs who have Act 120 "can" do vehicle stops, but from what I hear, the head sheriff frowns on it.