[DPB]

I had a reply typed out last night and thought I submitted it, I guess the computer defeated me.

FRISteve, I don't see that we are disagreeing on anything substantial. Although, I don't see using the standard 9mm figure as an issue, since the vast majority of 9mm ammo shot in the US is not +P. And I agree that the .357 SIG isn't necessarily loaded to the max figure, but then neither is the 9mm. In my opinion, comparing apples to apples means comparing the standard loads against each other, not comparing one standard load to the other's above standard load.

I'm sure that chamber pressure is an indicator of increased wear, but I suspect that power factor or muzzle energy is really the number we should be discussing. 82000+ rounds is the most I've heard of out of a Glock .40, and I would be very interested in knowing what parts you have had to replace (if any), and if that ammo was primarily factory or full power reloads, or if much of it was downloaded reloads. I don't mean to suggest anything negative by asking about downloaded ammo, most of the .45 I shoot is a 200 grain bullet at around 840 fps, for a number of practical and economic reasons.

G21.45, I did not intend to suggest that you were insincere or that your opinions were not valid. I believe a G21 sized gun, extra ammo, and a back up gun would take a substantial effort to conceal, and I appreciate you explaining how you carry it. I misunderstood one of your earlier posts and took it to mean that you carried multiple extra mags. I did understand that you always carried, and you are right, there is a certain commitment involved in that.

I totally agree that the 5.7 pistol, and even the P90 PDW, are of almost no utility, and I think this is true even if the SS190 (armor piercing) ammo was available. It is an interesting academic development, but I don't think anyone who is serious about protecting themselves should be relying on it.

Regarding velocity not being a factor in handguns, check the NIJ standards for ballistic vests. Level IIA, II, and IIIA vests all stop 9mms, but at respective velocities of 1090, 1175, and 1400 fps, respectively. All levels specify a 9mm, 124 grain, full metal jacket round nose bullet. So, clearly, it takes more Kevlar to stop the same bullet if it is travelling faster. Now, the 1400 fps number is generally only possible out of submachine guns, but the 1090 and 1175 are both within the reach of a service sized handgun.

I think I can explain why the .45 ACP has such a lower chamber pressure, but that, and military rifle cartridges, and the rapid delcline of the 10mm, are subjects for another day.